Understanding ones own strengths and weaknesses is key to working in today's world. Leaning to use, but not overuse your strengths, and deal appropriately with your weaknesses can propel you to new heights.
Some of this weeks episode highlights are:
18:40 Building more efficient and effective communication can improve your sales.
34:53 The four pillars of success: Competence, Confidence, Integrity, and Likability.
38:36 Confidence comes from recognizing your strengths. True competence depends on knowing when and how to use those strengths.
--- Full Raw Transcription of Podcast Below ---
Nancy Patchak (00:00:00):
Being able to be comfortable in the way that you communicate with people who do things differently than you do - that's huge in being successful!
Welcome to the SideHustle Lounge. If you're looking for flexible ways to earn income, grow your mindset, and live the lifestyle you've always dreamed of, you are in the right place. So lower the lights. Grab your favorite beverage and join your host. Founder of NotaryCoach.com and Amazon bestselling author of Sign and Thrive: How To Make Six Figures As A Mobile Notary And Loan Signing Agent, Bill Soroka.
Bill Soroka (00:00:48):
Cheers. Welcome to my guest today, Nancy Patchak, President and CEO of Real Connections, and an expert at the Everything DISC personality profile. Nancy - I'm so excited to have you here today. Thanks for being here.
Nancy Patchak (00:01:03):
Thanks for having me Bill and I'm super excited to be here as well.
Bill Soroka (00:01:08):
Well, good. I know we've been talking about this for a long time and I love how passionate you are in the realm of psychology and emotional intelligence and in particular the Everything DISC personality profile. And before we get too far into it, what is Everything DISC?
Nancy Patchak (00:01:32):
Well, the technical technical version is it's a model that provides personal development and training solutions, and that gives you an immediate and lasting impact on the performance of people and the cultures of organizations, but it's simple, but not simplistic. That's kind of the more hoity-toity scientific - that might be my elevator speech, but really what it is is this model provides a common language that people can use to really better understand themselves. And those that they interact with either personally or professionally, this isn't just something that you use at work. This is something that you can use throughout your life with all of your relationships and the knowledge that you get will help you reduce conflict, improve working relationships or personal relationships and help you communicate more effectively and efficiently.
Bill Soroka (00:02:37):
Yeah. I love that nutshell version. I mean, that really describes it. So, I mean, it sounds like what we're talking about here is relationships and communication, which are kind of the cornerstones of, of growing a peaceful life, an awesome life and even a business.
Nancy Patchak (00:02:51):
Exactly. And you know, what is nice about, about this DISC assessment is it's a tool for dialogue, not diagnosis. Nice. Yeah.
Bill Soroka (00:03:04):
And that leads me right to my, my, the first thing that I get a lot of pushback on when I talk about personality profiles is, you know, I don't like being put in a box. So I love that you talk that this is a tool for I'm sorry, what was it? Dialog not diagnosis. So what do you say to people like that?
Nancy Patchak (00:03:25):
Well, when I say to people like that is that this is not used for pigeonhole. This is part of the puzzle, that's you? It's descriptive, not prescriptive, so we're not going to give you a label. So I, you know, I'm an S but I'm an S style. The S doesn't necessarily define me. It's just a piece of who I am and to be truthful, we're all a blend of all of the four styles, a D I S and C. And we borrow from the strengths of each one when it's necessary or when it's important for us. You know, and being descriptive and that prescriptive, it makes it more relatable in, in the everyday world, because, you know, if you think about it, no two humans are alike and we're all delightful in unique in our own personal ways. And we get that way because of our life experiences, you know, think back to when you were 20 years old, you probably were a vastly different person than you are now.
Nancy Patchak (00:04:39):
Thankfully. Yes, yes. Yeah. Me too. You know, in those life experiences and the stages of life that we go through, our career changes, relationships, marriages, divorce, or have you, that's what gives us our gifts and our lovely quirks. And that's what makes us who we are. And this isn't about changing you. And that's, what's very important because you're fine. Everyone's fine. Perfect. Just the way you are, it's embracing those gifts and those quirks in your personality and how they come out in your behavior that we may try and change or tweak a little bit.
Bill Soroka (00:05:21):
Oh, I love that. And I, from my own personal experience with DISC, I would say that's exactly what happened. I started to appreciate some of what I was afraid were personality quirks, or, you know, flakiness, or sometimes like, over-controlling like sometimes I just have to control every little thing. And what I learned about myself really made me appreciate that and even recognize, oh, that's my D coming out, or that's my I coming out, or holy cow, that's my C what...
Nancy Patchak (00:05:57):
Does it helps us understand ourselves better so that we can really have a general, a genuine appreciation of others, you know, and why they do things that are different than you, or why we do things that are different than other people. And it really gives you a perspective of why we're drawn to some people. And we just having a connection and we enjoy being around them. And other people just annoy the heck out of us.
Bill Soroka (00:06:26):
That's so funny. I find myself saying, oh, that's an S or that's a C, or that's a really strong D in my room.
Nancy Patchak (00:06:33):
Yeah. And then that's the beauty of this, because it is, it's simple to use once you understand the the different characteristics of the different styles and you understand your own priorities or the areas where you spend most of your time. The more you understand yourself, the more you're going to be able to pick out the different styles of other people. And that's where the beauty really comes in because it's so usable.
Bill Soroka (00:07:02):
Well, and I remember one of the things that I think I learned from one of the workshops with you is having that knowledge of of yourself and then of other people, it helps you communicate in a way that the other person wants to be communicated with. So it just strengths and strengthens those relationships and helps both parties get what they want facts.
Nancy Patchak (00:07:25):
Right. And, you know, that's really what it is, what it's all about. It's adapting to others, not changing yourself, you know? Cause you think about it constructive change begins with your own self knowledge and just shows you how you can respond to conflict. What motivates you or what stresses you out? You know what might motivate me might stress the heck out of someone else. You know, for example, as an S I tend to speak a little slower unless I get really super excited. I, if someone asks me a question, I may take a second to answer now for a detail person that second that I take the answer could feel like three minutes. And you know, so that kind of stresses them out. But for me, that's, that's more of a motivator, you know, and then how to solve problems with people who just do things and think things differently than you.
Bill Soroka (00:08:30):
Yeah. And you just, you used a word a few seconds ago, I guess, about responding to situations. And I think that's one of the beautiful and most powerful components of a tool like the Everything DISC is that it allows you to take 100% responsibility for your life and circumstances because how you respond to life is there's a direct correlation to your success. But before we jump into that too much, we've been dropping letters left and right. If some of our listeners don't know what the Everything DISC is, they don't know what those letters mean. Maybe they don't even have a profile. So is there a place where they could take their profile and then can you maybe go into what these letters mean?
Nancy Patchak (00:09:16):
Yeah, you can always go to my website, which we will be leaving in the VIP room to take a profile or an assessment. It takes about 20 minutes, but we can, we can do just a short little description to help people understand what the four basic styles are. And the four basic styles are D which stands for dominance. People who have this style tend to be more results oriented. They challenge the status quo. They really like action. You know, they want to keep things moving, moving, moving, moving all the time. The I style stands for influence and people with the I style, they tend to approach work and pretty much everything with enthusiasm. I's are, are one of the easiest styles to to recognize because they're the ones they talk, they talk fast, they move fast, that smile, they use a lot of hand gestures.
Nancy Patchak (00:10:21):
They're the ones that are gonna plan the company party and be first in line at the karaoke machine. You know, they also enjoy collaboration. Now the S style stands for steadiness, which is what I am. I'm a very strong S. And the people with the S style tend to like to support people. If you need help with anything, we're the ones that enjoy collaboration and we're going to show up the C style stands for conscientiousness. These are people they focus on accuracy. They like stability and consistent outcomes. They use a lot of logic to challenge ideas. So they think something's wrong. They're going to call you out on it. And for a C, because they are very detail oriented, it's very important that they're not wrong. Not so important to me. Right. But they just don't want to be wrong. And they'll, they'll be the first ones to beat themselves up the most. If they do something that's not accurate. Yeah. That's basically a description on the four styles.
Bill Soroka (00:11:38):
And then there can be combinations of those. And like, for me, for instance, I'm an I D, I'm that influencer and the dominance like right on the line, like perfectly on the line.
Nancy Patchak (00:11:48):
Right, right. Yes. There's actually 12 styles, but we're probably going to focus mainly on the four main styles.
Bill Soroka (00:11:57):
Perfect. Yeah. That gives us a really good overview. And I know there's, there's people who have probably super embraced this. A lot of our listeners are into the personal development. So I think this is a perfect fit. And then you get the resistors that are going to be like, why, why the DISC? So why is learning about this so important?
Nancy Patchak (00:12:17):
Well, first of all, let me, let me just backtrack a little bit. Okay. I went over the four styles, but one of the things that does make us different from some of the other assessments out there, and you know, why I think DISC is really wonderful is how easy it is to understand and use it in the real world. So if you're asking yourself, well, how do I know what style I am? Even though I read some descriptions, you might not, not be a hundred percent sure. So I want you to do is just based on two planes. So think of yourself in two ways, do you see yourself more as fast paced and outspoken people that are fast paced and outspoken they're active, assertive, dynamic, bold people, or do you see yourself more as cautious and reflective? These are people that are more moderate pace.
Nancy Patchak (00:13:10):
They're calm, methodical, and thoughtful. Okay. So you'd put yourself on one of those two points. Okay. Now think of yourself in another way. Do you see yourself more as questioning and skeptical? Are you more logic focused, objective, reserved, maybe a little challenging or are you more accepting and warm? More people focused empathizeing. Receptive. Agreeable. So where are you land on those two planes basically will describe what your style may be. Now. This is pretty basic and it's not going to be a hundred percent accurate. It just, isn't a hundred percent accurate, but it's going to give you a pretty good baseline of what your style might be. So if you answer that you're fast paced and outspoken and questioning and skeptical, you're probably looking at a person that may be a D style. Now, if you, the answer that you were fast paced and outspoken, but acccepting and warm, you're looking at the characteristics of an I style.
Nancy Patchak (00:14:18):
And then if you answered that you were on the bottom plane, cautious and reflective, but accepting any warm, you've got the characteristics of the S style. And then finally, if you answered that you're cautious and reflective, but questioning and skeptical, then you're looking at the characteristics of a C style. Nice. So using that as a basic reference is pretty easy. You can, you can get a pretty good idea of a person's style within just a few minutes, once you get good at it. And what's unique about this is now that the world has kind of changed and gone a little crazy. We're working more remotely. We may not be having as many face-to-face interactions as we used to. You can also use this in text messages or emails. And I noticed Billy, when you and I text back and forth. I sent you a pretty good text that you might have to scroll up to read the whole thing. Right. And I'll get a, you might say, okay, got it.
Bill Soroka (00:15:34):
That's the, that's the D for dominance, right?
Nancy Patchak (00:15:37):
Yeah. That's the D just results in and out of here kind of thing. And so now I'm starting to understand that. I don't need to tell you, ask you about your day and your weekend and everything else, just facts, Jack. That's all you need.
Bill Soroka (00:15:56):
Well, and I think though, on my I side, I really appreciate the warmth and a little bit of a warmup, but you might just get more of a direct answer right, right. On the return. Yeah. Interesting.
Nancy Patchak (00:16:09):
Right. Okay. So you asked me why DISC yeah.
Bill Soroka (00:16:17):
What do you mean? Why does this matter? Why does it matter learning this, that kind of stuff?
Nancy Patchak (00:16:21):
Well, one of the biggest things that I've noticed is, you know, is the fact that people behave differently or they understand things differently when I was growing up I used to call her, or my dad used to call it common sense or common courtesy. And as I've grown older, I come to the realization that what's common to me is not necessarily common to anyone else. So that kind of common courtesy common sense goes right out the window. It doesn't mean that anyone someone's doing something wrong or doing something to offend me it just means that they communicate and behave differently than I do. And so for me to be successful, whether personally or professionally, I need to learn how to navigate that.
Bill Soroka (00:17:20):
Yeah. That's a huge realization because I think number one, I think we tend to take for granted that everybody acts or appreciates or values the same things that we do. And then we also seem to project our own values on other people. And I think that's the trap of that is kind of getting stuck in victim hood, right? Like, oh my gosh, can you believe they did this to me? Can you believe they said that? Can you believe they didn't? Okay. That kind of thing. Right,
Nancy Patchak (00:17:50):
Exactly. You know, and that's one of the things I, as an S, I sometimes have a hard time with, with the D style because to me, sometimes they can come across as know blunt and it's like, oh, I might get my feelings hurt, but for a D style person, they're like, what are you talking about? We're just having a conversation.
Bill Soroka (00:18:17):
Practice trying to be efficient.
Nancy Patchak (00:18:18):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, it's, it's, it's interesting to navigate that kind of thing. And that's really what sparked my interest in this because personality and behaviors and social psychology is really interesting to me. And there's so much you can do with it, especially professionally, if you understand it, think about it. If you're in sales, I did a session with a realtor friend of mine, and she was unaware of how to recognize different personalities.
Nancy Patchak (00:19:00):
And she herself is a very bubbly person. She went through a session with us and later she talked about a couple that she sold the house to the wife was very bubbly like her. And they shared some cocktail recipes and husband was a little more know a little more reserved than didn't talk a whole lot. So when she was taking them out, her house hunting, she picked up on this. So when she was showing houses, she would tell away, oh, look at this party palace we've got going on here for entertainment, right. Look at this great kitchen. You can fit a lot of people in here when you've got company. And, you know, she was very excited about that. Now, when she was talking to the husband, she turned it more inward and more technical. She started talking about the taxes, how the taxes were relatively low for that house, how they just put a new roof on it, new wiring, things like that. And that's what really lit him up. So just think of how that building a more effective and efficient communication can improve your sales, your sales skills.
Bill Soroka (00:20:19):
Yeah, no kidding. Talk to me what keeps coming to me when I hear you say this kind of stuff is adapting to the situation, you're become a lot more adaptable.
Nancy Patchak (00:20:27):
Bill Soroka (00:20:30):
And to me, it's Helping to - it helps you get not only what you want, but it helps the vision become a reality. So what's what, like what serves you, you no longer have to kind of kick back and just take what's coming to you. You can adapt to a situation and help, you know, talk about what's important to them at the time.
Nancy Patchak (00:20:51):
And with this, it shows you how to borrow from the different strengths of the other styles without turning yourself into that style. If you try and become someone that you're not, have you ever, have you ever had those awkward people who you know, they're, you know, they're talking to you, but they kind of seem like a weird alien robot because their personality seems a little awkward, you know, like they're forcing something. And that's, that's a really good example of trying to be someone you're not, and, you know, it might work for a little bit, but it's not gonna work for very, a very long time. And people are probably gonna see through that. And you're going to come across maybe as a little, little more insincere.
Bill Soroka (00:21:37):
Yeah. Insincere inauthentic, or straight up weird.
Nancy Patchak (00:21:40):
Yeah, exactly. So what, you know, what we try and help people do is understand what their strengths are. If they need to borrow strengths from another style, you can do that. But you, you, you borrow those strengths from your own style. So if I, you know, as an S, typically S's are a little more quiet and reserved, and we don't do a whole lot of public speaking which is that a problem for me is it's something I've always enjoyed doing, but I think that's because I've learned to stretch into, you know, like maybe the I or the territory. And I turned myself into a powerful S I don't turn, trying to turn myself into an I or a D. Does that make sense?
Bill Soroka (00:22:28):
Yeah, totally. So you just go to where you need to go to serve the purpose and then be able to retreat back to where or who you are.
Nancy Patchak (00:22:38):
Correct. Let me give you an example. I didn't even, I think you may have heard this. I do use this a lot in my session. But I think it really, really does a good job of explaining how you can borrow from the strengths of the other style. I have a trainer in a wonderful gym in Phoenix, and I pegged him as probably an I. He's very energetic, very enthusiastic in the gym. I was talking to him. And when he took the assessment, he came out as a C pretty strong. And I was, wow. I was kind of flabbergasted. I know I definitely can be wrong, but I, I thought, you know, wow, I was really wrong. So then I got me thinking I started watching. And when when he's in gym, he goes, you will never see him go up to someone and go, Hey, I got this great this great exercise, you're going to love it. It's going to be so much fun. Let's go do it. He's not going to do that. But what he does do, he'll come up to a client and he'll say, Hey, I got this great exercise. It's going to work your, your biceps, your deltoids, and that's going to interact with this and that. And it's really going to give you a great workout. That's what he's, he's turning himself into him, very powerful C, but he's borrowing from the enthusiasm of an I style
Bill Soroka (00:24:06):
And still staying true to a C because he's got well thought out well-researched details. Right, right. Interesting.
Nancy Patchak (00:24:15):
Right. So why this, I guess I keep coming back to that. One of the things is in, today's kind of crazy, mixed up world is soft skills are becoming very important. Yes. you know, and that's, again, what I, what soft skills are, is what I, I equate it to common sense and common, common courtesy, but now it's really become a pretty big deal in a lot of businesses. Or just basically any, any, any profession I read a report, I think it was in Forbes recently that 74% of the CFO was still intent on having people work remotely, even after the pandemic is over in the foreseeable future. And that got me thinking, it's like, you know, I don't know if we realize the, you know, the human connection that we're missing. I know some of us do some of us I have a friend who is a C and she's like, oh, hi, was this I was made for a pandemic and stay home and not talk to anyone where I have my I friends were all, you know, it's like, I need to see people, you know, and I think they're probably, maybe you're the ones that have the 14 zoom sessions a day, but, you know, we need that human interaction.
Nancy Patchak (00:25:49):
You know, even if it's from a coworker, noticing that you're having a bad day, you know, talking about your friend weekend at the coffee maker you know, those mundane connections, you know, they're really important to us, you know, on a human level. And we need that, you know, some more than others and, you know, soft skills. Aren't something that, you know, that you can really teach like Excel or word or anything like that. So it was still, it's still an absolute mystery to me, but right, right. Well,
Bill Soroka (00:26:23):
I struggle with that too. And I love that you're even talking about this on the teaching of the soft skills, but before I even talk about that, can you maybe give our listeners a better idea of what an example of a soft skill is, or a couple examples?
Nancy Patchak (00:26:40):
Well, soft skills basically are classified, is a combination of personality traits, behavior, and social attributes attitudes that allow people to communicate more effectively to collaborate and to successfully manage conflict. So it's kind of a, you know, a roundabout almost, almost like an innate personality sorta, but how you related to the business world. You know, one of the important thing is when I think of soft skills is how people manage conflict and conflict. If you think about how often you deal with conflict, if you're in an office as a manager in a leadership position, you may spend a good portion of your day dealing with unproductive conflict. You know, that costs companies in the United States, billions of dollars. If you have a lot of conflicts, you probably are going to have a lot of unhappy workers. If you have a lot of unhappy workers, you're going to end up having a lot of turnover. A lot of turnover means a lot of time and money. Money is wasted where soft skills come in to play and where this comes into play. It helps you to manage conflict in a way that's productive that allows your employees to handle the con the conflict situation themselves rather than having it escalate up to management or higher up.
Bill Soroka (00:28:20):
Yeah. So it's basically it's communication skills, maybe not taking things personally ability to bounce back from adversity, listening skills, you know, all those things that like in my world, right. I teach mobile notaries and loan signing agents across the country. And we talk a lot about the documents, you know, how the sign, date, and stamp paperwork which is obviously super critical when you're working with documents that could you know, affect human beings on all levels. I mean, fortunes are transferred with the swipe of our pen and our seal of our stamp and rights are granted to others about making life and death decisions for us. So that's important, but the stuff that we can't teach, or it's more difficult to teach, I'll say, are these soft skills, like, how are you showing up to the world? How are you interacting with the world around you? It's such a critical piece to being successful in a relationship-based business.
Nancy Patchak (00:29:21):
You are absolutely correct. And, you know, and if you think about it you know, because it's not something that, that can be easily taught like a hard skill, because you have to engage not only, you know, your prefrontal cortex, but you know, your primitive brain, you know, your caveman brain your heart and soul and shake it all up.
Bill Soroka (00:29:44):
Yeah. In the mixer. Yeah. Yeah.
Nancy Patchak (00:29:47):
And what's, what's also difficult is we have our own, you know, our own strengths, our own priorities, where we're comfortable in, and it's hard to get away from that, especially in a conflict situation or a high pressure situation. We tend to revert back to what's comfortable for us. And that may not always be appropriate in every situation.
Bill Soroka (00:30:15):
What a great point. It's almost like our strengths that might serve us so well, can oftentimes if we use them too much or in the wrong situation, they become weak.
Nancy Patchak (00:30:27):
That's correct. And you, when you mentioned your loan signing, I worked in mortgage lending for quite a few years and we did have a loan signer that came in and he was pretty outgoing. We had a couple of different ones and there, and now that I'm thinking about them, they're vastly different DISC styles. But the one that was our main loan signer, he was very bubbly, very outgoing. He could talk to a rock and making it his best friend and we would have some customers that were coming in to refinance and we're going through a tough time. You know, it wasn't really a happy experience for them. They had to refinance because that was their only option. And he would go in there, his bubbly self and, you know, jovial and not picked up on the body language or the dialogue of the customers and what kind of made for, you know, some uncomfortability, you know, and that's where I'm, I'm thinking, you know, when you're on your notary business or any other kind of business, when you're looking to build up clientele or customers, you want to make that last week connection, you know, you want to build a relationship that's gonna last.
Nancy Patchak (00:31:54):
So you need to learn how to connect quickly to people on the level that they're on.
Bill Soroka (00:32:01):
Yeah. Like meet them where they're at. And that's, I love this example because it is so important. I think speaks exactly to what we're talking about here is reading your audience, you know, and talk about a strength. Overused is that enthusiasm will probably serve him well in 90% of his loan signing appointments, but that 10% is huge. And it can really do some damage to the foundation of a relationship as you're just getting started. If you don't read those signs.
Nancy Patchak (00:32:32):
Right. Exactly. Or, you know, you're the complete opposite, and you're just sign here, here's your interest rate. Here's, you know, and you've got your first time home buyers who are just exploding with excitement, you know, you haven't, you haven't made that connection and, you know, title companies, whoever you're signing for you pick up on that, you know, they want, they want someone that's gonna give their clients the best experience. So they have repeat customers as well.
Bill Soroka (00:33:02):
Yeah. Huge. It serves everybody down the chain, you know, whether it's obviously serves your relationship and if you're representing somebody else at the closing table, or if you're making a deal for a company or selling for a company, all of this has an impact on that.
Nancy Patchak (00:33:17):
Exactly. you know, and then what's, what's interesting too, about the soft skills and how important they are. You know, people are really picking up on the importance of soft skills. And I read an a survey. I think, I think actually our research company did it, but they interviewed 2,500 business professionals. And 98% of the leaders agreed that soft skills were a huge, important part of developing the social and emotional skills of their employees. But here's the kicker only 9% actually had a program in place or had something to help employees learn these kinds of soft skills. Is that crazy? That's what
Bill Soroka (00:34:06):
Blows. Yeah. That's what blows my mind. There's so many people in authority or in influencer position that agree that that is such a huge factor in whether or not to keep an employee, but also from a success factor, you know, depending on the business. But if you're in a people business, you've got to have these soft skills, but there's still not the training, or I guess, formal training available because these resources are available. You have programs like DISC, you have personal development webinars, you have training courses and all that good stuff, but it's all to the individual to take that on and, and, and learn that. And I really think it should be a, for lack of a better word, institutionalized, like it should be brought in. There should be a program to help out with this. And if you don't mind that I, you know, I think this is kind of the perfect place.
Bill Soroka (00:34:56):
I love that you brought in that statistic from Forbes because in my business, I have a framework that I teach and it works for mobile notaries and loan signing agents, but it really, it lists, it will work for any service-based side hustle or business or even job, but it's the four pillars of success in this business is number one is competency. Like, you've, obviously you've got to be able to do your job. Well, that's going to be important confidence. You've got to be able to demonstrate your abilities in a way that makes people feel comfortable and doesn't turn them off. And three integrity. Integrity is huge. You to know what you can do, what you can't do, and then follow through with your promises. If you're say you're going to be there at nine, either at nine or communicate and renegotiate, but then the final lay of this thing, or the final pillar, I think is probably the most important.
Bill Soroka (00:35:55):
And that's likability that's. Do people enjoy working with you or doing business with you? And to me, this I've seen it so many times. Nancy I've have amazingly competent notaries in my community. They're confident they know their stuff inside and out, and they've got impeccable integrity, but the likability factor, they've got some things like judgment harshness bold communication that is maybe too direct. Maybe they are D's that come across so directly that it makes people avoid working with them. So they've got all these amazing skills. I've got all the other three pillars, but these soft skills are lacking and they don't succeed because people won't hire them.
Nancy Patchak (00:36:44):
Yeah. That's, that's exactly true. And I love those, those pillars. And I actually, you know, I think kind of relate to those pillars you know, through the scope of DISC, you know, with competence, you know, getting out of your comfort zone when it's necessary, you know, it keeps your strengths from becoming the only tool in your toolbox. That, again, that goes back to falling back on our natural comfort zone and, you know, being able to be comfortable in the way that you communicate with people who do things differently than you do, you know, that's huge in being successful. Not only professionally, but, you know, as a human people, you know, maybe you might find that you're actually the annoying one is the one driving everyone crazy.
Bill Soroka (00:37:45):
Yeah. It's a harsh, harsh reality, but it's true sometimes.
Nancy Patchak (00:37:47):
Yeah. Yeah. What an eye opening experience. And I also recognize that too. Yeah, because I had a partner I worked with and she was a very high I, and she had tons of wonderful ideas and moving really fast and a lot of ideas, not much follow through. You know, sometimes I'd have to say, oh, you gotta tone your I down. It's stepping on my S a little bit, driving me a little crazy, but I have to realize as well that, you know, sometimes I have to bring my S up and meet her I, and, you know, get in that conga line and be a little more excited and emotional because that's what she needs to. But, you know, confidence that comes from recognizing your strengths, but true competence depends on knowing when and how to use those strengths as well. So that goes back to, to recognizing your strengths and when to tone them down, reel them in if necessary, or, you know, bring them out a little more loud and proud, you know? And for integrity, I read an interesting quote that reminded me when you, when you, when you read your pillar on integrity Aristotle argued that our true virtues lie somewhere between deficiency and excess. Does that make sense?
Bill Soroka (00:39:18):
Yeah, totally. That's true. Yeah.
Nancy Patchak (00:39:21):
And that's kind of, you know, talking about strengths that we use to excess and trying to find that balance so that our, our strengths don't go to the dark side and we become that annoying person or that someone who isn't acting or communicating I guess, would be a better, better way or connecting with the person on a level that they need to. And that's what you need to do and recognize when and where to do it to become successful. Yeah. And that leads into the likability, you know, being able to adapt to others in real time, you know, learning how to build better, longer lasting relationships. Again, that's what business is about. You want to keep growing and in your personal life same way you want to build, build those lasting relationships and connect with the people that were close to, you know, so, you know, adapting to others, not changing yourself to communicate more effectively and efficiently. That's, what's really going to build the trust and the likability, you know, people want to be around and do business with people that they like. That's pretty much
Bill Soroka (00:40:35):
Yeah. They know like, and trust, right? Yeah. That's the, that's the, that's the key. And to me, you know, I, I think that was such a beautiful summary. And if I was going to ask you now, why DISC, why go through learning about yourself, how you show up and how others show up that you just answered it perfectly because that likability factor is so powerful.
Nancy Patchak (00:40:55):
Yeah. Yeah. Because the basis for liking someone is if you can communicate well and really make that human connection with them, everyone wants to make that connection. Everyone wants, everyone wants to bring out the best in themselves. And, you know, truthfully, if you think about it, we all want to bring out the best in other people. Yeah. Otherwise, yeah, we wouldn't try so hard to, you know, maybe make friends with that annoying person.
Bill Soroka (00:41:23):
You get into business in the first place. If we're bringing value to the marketplace or value to the world, we want to enhance the world. And this is one small way to do it, which is a huge
Nancy Patchak (00:41:31):
Way. Exactly. So this kind of like a, a good segue into a module that I teach about strengths becomming weaknesses.
Bill Soroka (00:41:44):
Yeah. Perfect. What are some of those,
Nancy Patchak (00:41:48):
Well, to give you an idea, let's use, say... what style have we not talked about? How about the C? Okay. Let's, let's talk about some things that you'll notice about a C. They strive for reliability. They ensure accuracy. They provide logical analysis, question, ideas, maintain high standards. Those are all great and wonderful things. But what happens if they're overused?
Bill Soroka (00:42:25):
Like the analysis paralysis comes in...
Nancy Patchak (00:42:27):
That is exactly where the analysis paralysis comes in. Here's a good, here's a good thing to think about all you listeners out there, close your eyes for a second to think of someone that you really love or respect.
Bill Soroka (00:42:42):
Not if you're driving, leave your eyes open if you're Driving!
Nancy Patchak (00:42:44):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You'll just concentrate really hard. But on the road think about the strengths of that person that you really appreciate. Maybe some of the strengths that, that we talked about in some of the different styles. Okay. Now think about what drives you. Absolutely crazy about that person. What makes you just literally want to pull your hair out? The same stuff? It's nine out of 10 times, it's the same behavior. It's just overused crazy. And now, you know, the secret at of over of at least 75% of the conflict in the world today.
Bill Soroka (00:43:32):
It's strength overused!
Nancy Patchak (00:43:36):
Yeah. So whether you overuse your strengths or someone else overuses his or her strengths, the result is oftentimes conflict. When I first read that, that kind of blew my mind. And that's what really made me want to dive in deeper into DISC so that I can understand people because nobody likes conflict.
Nancy Patchak (00:43:59):
So maybe some of these do Iike conflict, but just kidding. That's pigeonholing, you know, we would all like, you know, peace and harmony and productive conflict, I guess I should say. And just understanding and using better communication skills is the way to get around that to be successful. But back to our C people. So one of their strengths is to provide, you know, they provide precise expectations and standard operating procedures. They're the ones that are going, gonna follow the rules. And yeah, that's great, but it also may lead new learners to, you know, like unrealistic high expectations if you're saying on your job. And they come over with three giant binders. This is what you need to learn. Yeah. Or, you know, because they approach problems systematically and logically. No, that's great. But maybe if you're a little too critical in finding you might come across as a little nit picky
Bill Soroka (00:45:15):
Do the C's tend to run slower - more slowly on things on decisions.
Nancy Patchak (00:45:20):
Yeah, exactly. And that's, that's where you get the analysis paralysis, where, you know, we're going to, we're going to analyze everything and death and, and it's hard for a C to make a decision that's rushed because they want to make sure that it's going to be the best decision and they don't want to be wrong. So, you know, if, if you were going to go into, this is another good example of why you need to add to your toolbox, if you may ... if you're going into a meeting of C's. And you're also a pretty, pretty good C, and so, you know, you're going to be walking into a bunch of analytical thinkers. Don't bring more analytical thinking to the meeting, because then you're just going to sit there for, you know, three times longer analyzing thing. Maybe you need to bring out a little bit of a D and talk about some of the things, but get the ball rolling. Does that make sense?
Bill Soroka (00:46:27):
Yeah, totally. Yeah.
Nancy Patchak (00:46:29):
So, you know, once you start learning the different characteristics of the styles, then you can start to understand their weaknesses as well. So if you notice an annoying behavior in someone, look for the strength that there, that there may be overusing, and if you can find it, then you've just opened a door to connect with them. What does that look like?
Bill Soroka (00:46:58):
The connection for that? How can you use that tool or that knowledge?
Nancy Patchak (00:47:03):
Well, for, okay. If say if a C is you're feeling like, you know, they come in with their big three binders you may just need to tell them, wow. You know, I appreciate the fact that you're very knowledgeable. Maybe you could give me an idea of what exactly I need to study first or outline of what I need to look at or time that kind of thing. Right. You know, cause a lot of times the see they may be comfortable working by themselves for me as an S, I can be comfortable working by myself. But if you were just to say, you know, I need you to look up business licenses and then just leave it at that. I'm going to sit there for about 15 minutes in a sweat, wondering what exactly you need. And then I'm going to research it to death.
Nancy Patchak (00:48:05):
And I'm going to bury you in paperwork to make sure that I get you everything you need when maybe simply you just needed the address to go and get your business license, that kind of thing. So that's in a nutshell I like to talk about the D's a little bit more. Like I said, I have a little bit of problems when I work with these styles, because a lot of the times I ended up getting my feelings hurt when actually they're just, that's just conversation to them. And so if I feel that I'm getting my, maybe they're being rude or blunt, I got to realize that they're just looking to move things along. They want results. And sometimes they may be moving too fast. So you may need to reel them in a little bit. It's like, Hey, I understand you want to get these things done, but you're missing details. So we're going to reel it in a little bit and focus on some of the things that are important that we may have overlooked.
Bill Soroka (00:49:15):
And I would say again, recognizing the value of knowing where you stand, right? There's gotta be some peace of mind in that confidence that you just mentioned and knowing, Hey, I'm an S or I'm a C or whatever it might be like, these are the things I'm thinking about. And I think you should be too. And having that confidence encouraged to step forward and acknowledge a D where they're at and also say, and have you thought about
Nancy Patchak (00:49:38):
Exactly understanding yourself and your strengths is powerful and that is going to give you the confidence to get your point across as an S one of the things, one of my strengths is that, you know, we're team players, we wanna go, you know, go with the flow and support the team, which is fine, but I can't tell you how many times someone has come up with an idea and everyone else likes it, but I am an inside going, oh my God, you realize what is going to happen if you do this, because I don't want to rock the boat. I don't say anything. So I ended up backing an idea that I don't necessarily believe in. And then, you know, when it does blow up and I, you know, of course I could have told you that would happen.
Bill Soroka (00:50:36):
So that that's another example of your strength of going with the flow, being overused and not stepping in and saying something when you, when it calls for it.
Nancy Patchak (00:50:46):
Right. And, you know, had I said something, we could have avoided a lot of, a lot of the conflict or a lot of the issues that resulted from it. And you know, it doesn't make people happy. Then when you put them through something that you knew wasn't going to work, you know, and then they're like, oh, thanks for speaking up. Or I told you, so. Yeah. And then, and then that affects your credibility too.
Bill Soroka (00:51:14):
Yeah. Powerful stuff. You know, one, the one letter we haven't really talked about in strengths overused too much is the I, except in your example, with the loan side or anything else you want to say on the I?
Nancy Patchak (00:51:25):
Sure, sure. One of the things with I's is you know, and they're, they're one of my favorite styles just because they always want to be a little more like an I because I'm a little quieter and, you know, especially in social settings, if you know, one of the worst things in the world for me is to have to go into a room with people that I don't know and make small talk. I need a lot of cocktails. That's pretty difficult for me. You know, where, and I have a good friend that is an I, you know, within five minutes, she's best friends with everyone knows their spouses. And it's, you know, they're great women for me because I just follow them along and then I'd get comfortable pretty quick and bring out my personality. But so yeah, so I's are very friendly. They're very engaging, but they may come across as too sensitive or too agreeable, too trusting, too flexible, maybe even a little flighty.
Bill Soroka (00:52:28):
What about nosey? Do they get pinned as nosey sometimes?
Nancy Patchak (00:52:31):
Yeah, I think, yeah, they do because they want to get to know people and you know, they're going to, they're going to talk to people. They want to, you know, they want to influence the room. That's, you know, why their style is called influence. They want to influence the environment they're in. You have an I over to your house for a party. I bet you in about 10 minutes, the playlist will be the I's which is that, you know, it it's, it's not necessarily a bad thing until it might get to be too much and they want to control everything, but they may generate too much optimism and enthusiasm. You know, they may make promises that they can't necessarily deliver just to make people happy. So that's also a good thing, too, if you do recognize in yourself or in someone else that you're working with that, cause that can be pretty annoying when people tell you, oh, I can do this. You can do that. And then it comes back. No, you can't just, that's when you can just kind of talk to them and say, Hey, you know, if, if you can't, that's okay, just be honest upfront with me, and then we can find another solution and work through it. And that's how you avoid conflict or at least unproductive conflict and hurt feelings. That's the other thing nobody really wants to work or be around someone that you're mad at or that's mad at you. That's pretty uncomfortable. Exactly.
Bill Soroka (00:54:01):
And from my experience with I's too, and you know, I'm on that ID side for sure. So I rarely meet an idea I don't like, so I'm often I when in my unhealthiest phase, I would say yes to virtually everything, but now I have a lot of I's in my world and I've learned that when I have a, an idea, my enthusiasm carries over and they're enthusiastic about it. And I've learned to give them an action item. If you're really interested to do this, then do this. And what that does is that sets it up, like no expectations. If they do that step, I know they're serious and they want to move forward on it. And if they don't, then it's no harm, no foul. We have a very enthusiastic conversation. Nobody's feelings are hurt, but those few people that do take the action, we can actually do something together.
Nancy Patchak (00:54:51):
That's great. That's, you know, that's a wonderful way of recognizing someone's behavioral style and, and meeting them in the middle instead of, you know, burning a bridge and building bridges or taking it all personally. Yeah. Yeah. And that is, I think we've talked about this with your I style and a lot of ideas, not a lot of follow-through.
Bill Soroka (00:55:14):
Yeah. Yeah. That's been the story of my life, you know going through 26 different business failures, a lot of it had to tie into my I style on the Enneagram. I'm a seven, the enthusiast is very similar, you know, bounce from shiny object to sign shiny object. I love a good idea. I love to get optimistic about it, but that follow through was what was really lacking until, you know, I had my, you know, my wake-up call and I realized I have to go to my D in, in the DISC format. I had to be more direct. I had to set up habits, systems, routines to help, help me be successful. I could not be, just be an I without supporting myself. The ideas only serve so far either I had to bring people in or I had to set up systems for myself. And that's exactly what I do.
Nancy Patchak (00:56:05):
So you're actually tapping into also the C, the C, where you are kind of had to slow yourself down and focus more on the details and formulate a plan that you actually get past step two.
Bill Soroka (00:56:19):
Yeah, exactly. Which blew my mind. Cause that just turned me off so much. I was like, I don't want to be that. I feel what habits and routines are for boring people. I don't want that standard operating procedures. I have a friend that uses SOP all the time and I hear that and I'm just like cringe, but I'm like, oh,
Bill Soroka (00:56:37):
I need to SOP, I need to do this. I need these systems in place.
New Speaker (00:56:42):
Oh, can you just see, just say SOP? And I'm like, oh, that was those. I just love those because I'm going to follow the rules. Yeah. What, what is really fun if you're not quite sure if someone is an I and you're maybe a C or S put some Ikea furniture together. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Yeah. That, that will really give you an idea of how important understanding behavioral tendencies are.
Bill Soroka (00:57:19):
So what C's and S's love it and then I's and D's do not. Is that how it works? Well
Nancy Patchak (00:57:24):
I will look at the picture and then that's the last little ever look at the instructions and they'll get done and they may have, they may have extra parts, but it doesn't matter. They'll give it a shake. And if it's not that wobbly, we're good to go.
Bill Soroka (00:57:39):
Oh my gosh, I feel you see me right now.
Nancy Patchak (00:57:41):
Yeah. And then I said, you know, S's and C's were, you know, we're still on page one, making sure that we counted off pieces and we have all the rights that we're supposed to have. And you know, if we have an extra piece, probably won't be able to sleep that night.
Bill Soroka (00:58:04):
And then D's hire somebody else to do it.
Nancy Patchak (00:58:06):
Yeah. These are the D's will just say it's okay. Just leave it alone just the time. And that's fine too, because then that is actually a real life example. I did put together some Ikea furniture with a very high I and it was a lesson for both of us in, in trying to understand what drives each other crazy. And I had to give up on the, I had an extra piece, there was a picture of the piece goes here, but every time you turn it over, the piece just falls out and I was told it's not necessary. And I couldn't comprehend that.
Bill Soroka (00:58:44):
Why do they put it there, it's not necessary!
Nancy Patchak (00:58:46):
It's in the the pictures, you know, slowly breaking out in hives. But I, I had to just let it go. It's not wobbly. It's fine.
Bill Soroka (00:58:57):
What a fantastic demonstration of how these personality profiles work, you might have to start incorporating Ikea furniture into your workshops.
Nancy Patchak (00:59:10):
Oh yeah. Well, it is, it is definitely a test to understand different personality types. I can, I can tell you that learning how to either not become the annoying person or not become annoyed with the person that you're working with.
Bill Soroka (00:59:29):
That second one is the one I would struggle.
Nancy Patchak (00:59:35):
Speaking of that with the DISC assessment, it really is a wonderful tool. And it's how this works is you take an assessment and then the at assessment generates a 20 page 20, maybe a little over 20 page profile, depending on, on the assessment that you take. You get this wonderful profile that you can look at on any device, your computer, your phone, iPad, whatever, or you can print off a hard copy it's stock full of videos that you can watch that explain people with each of the styles, how they relate to things, how you relate to the other styles. And then the real magic is in a classroom or a virtual facilitated session where we go through the assessment. And that's where we really dive into your style, your priorities, your stressors, your motivators, and that's where the magic really happens.
Nancy Patchak (01:00:37):
And you get those aha moments. And then we have wonderful follow-up tools that you can use. You can run comparison reports with someone in your organization to show how, how well you'll work together. Say if you're a D or C that, you know, you may be not, not that close together, but there are certain areas in working together where you are closer and there's continuums that show whether you're active or outgoing more private or more closed off or open, I guess I should say. And then it tells you roadblocks that you may face, and then it gives you ideas on how to overcome those roadblocks. So if you think about when you're on a perfect world, we'd love to work with all people, with people that we know, but you know, that doesn't happen that often. Especially in, in all the craziness. Now this is a wonderful tool that can get get you and another person on the same page, much quicker. I mean, it could take you weeks or months to really build a relationship where you learn these things about someone. This is something that takes literally 10 minutes.
Bill Soroka (01:01:52):
Yeah. That's what I love about your profiles here with everything desk. And I will say it's the most high quality product that I've ever seen you're in your reports or the summary of these personalities are eerily accurate. I was like, oh my, do they have cameras in my house? How did they know this
Nancy Patchak (01:02:18):
Yeah. There's an long podcast dedicated to your particular style that it's like, oh, they actually are saying things that I've said. And they know that, but you know, the real magic is, you know, in the palm of your hand, you've got your, your assessment, your profile, and it teaches that it has instructions for you on how to work with each style. So if you're going in to a meeting with someone who is an opposite style, that you're, you feel you're not quite making a connection with us, or as much as you'd like, look up their style, find out what you need to do to connect with them on a better level.
Bill Soroka (01:03:01):
That's where exactly where I was going with this. And this is why I love the reports and the tools that you have, because it allows you to make practical use of this information. So many people go to a workshop, maybe they work. Like I remember working at Wells Fargo and they brought in a DISC facilitator and we did this and everybody was like, oh yeah, yeah, great. This is what we do. And then we went into our cubicles and we put it in the drawer. And that was it. I mean, we never talked about it again. I think that's, I think that's the real that's too bad, but when you give us the tools to practically use it and what you just described, you know, if for anybody listening, if you work in a relationship based business, this is the kind of stuff we're talking about when we mean that when you know how you show up to the world, like, how do you communicate?
Bill Soroka (01:03:51):
How do you interact? And then how other people interact? You can cut the relationship curve to a fraction of the time. You know, if it takes you nine months, let's say you happen to be an S a C or an I, but you are trying to build a relationship with somebody who's a D it can be really frustrating for a D if you're filling it with fluff and over information or talking about things that aren't important to that D if you recognize that they're a D you can cut right to give them what they want, communicate the way they want to be communicated to. And vice versa too, if you're a D and you're trying to communicate with an S as Nancy described, you can find ways to build things up. You might use more warmth in supportive communication to get your foot in the door and build those types of relationships.
Nancy Patchak (01:04:40):
That's the power of a tool like this. It makes you more confident and more competent as well. And, you know, you build your four pillars that I think are absolutely wonderful. You'll be able to nail those and be comfortable in doing it. To me, that's one of the important things is this, isn't, this isn't like learning Excel. You know, this is it's more soft, I guess, the soft skills, but it's more personable. It's something that will make you a better person
Bill Soroka (01:05:12):
All the way around. And you can use this, not even just in business, but even at home with your family and Thanksgiving dinner, you know, everywhere.
Nancy Patchak (01:05:21):
Think about it with your in-laws, your ex, you know, even your kids. I've learned that my son is probably a C. So that's helped me in as far as parenting and guiding him and even disciplining him because he's a C I don't need to scream and holler at them. I just need to point out what he did, what, what, what is wrong, and he's going to beat himself up pretty good anyway, and then we talk our way through it, and that's, you know, that works better. And he learns things from it. Then, you know, going off.
Bill Soroka (01:06:01):
Well, the powerful parenting tool, I love that. Nancy. It has been an amazing 67 minute conversation with you. I've loved this. I love that you're so passionate about human psychology and social skills, emotional intelligence. And of course the Everything DISC for those that are listening, and would like to get dialed more into what Nancy has to offer. You can visit the side hustle lounge at SideHustleLounge.com/vip to join the VIP room, free access to all kinds of resources for our guests, but we will have a special discount code for the Everything DISC profile and assessment that Nancy has plus so much more. Nancy, thank you so much for joining us and sharing so much of yourself today.
Nancy Patchak (01:06:54):
You're welcome, Billy. It was a pleasure, had a lot of fun. And also congratulations on this new endeavor that you've you've started. It's pretty interesting. Well
Bill Soroka (01:07:06):
Done. Well much. We're excited. We're excited. I'm glad you took part in this.
Nancy Patchak (01:07:12):
I am too.
Bill Soroka (01:07:13):
All right, we'll catch you next time.
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